Comments on: Brush Off From NZ Minister of Transport

By: Vik Olliver

Vik Olliver — Tue, 08 Jun 2010 00:07:47 +0000

I'm told that POLi requires ActiveX scripts to work properly, and so won't work for Linux and Mac users:

https://airnzau.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2450/~/can-i-pay-by-internet-banking-%28poli%29-if-i%27m-using-mac-os-x%3F

By: Nicolas

Nicolas — Sun, 06 Jun 2010 00:02:45 +0000

Jonathan, gets worse with Kiwibank sign in. You MUST confirm your login by using your mouse to click on some things. Can't be done keyboard only… And doesn't work without Javascript…

By: Jonathan

Jonathan — Sat, 05 Jun 2010 20:09:07 +0000

Any competent web developer should be practising ubobtrusive javascript and progressive enhancement techniques so that a core process is functional without javascript. This is particularly so when dealing with a government agency.

(As a datapoint, I just tried ASB Bank with javascript disabled and their navigation disappeared on some pages. Definitely not progressive enhancement, so shame on them.)

By: Somebody

Somebody — Fri, 14 Aug 2009 06:34:20 +0000

Javascript is not necessary to run the internet. It does however enhance things. Like creating dynamic lists.

Of course there are ways around things, but when you run a business for profit you do them the way of least resistance.

Would POli change if the NZTA required it, maybe if it was easy enough. However POli has a lot of other clients like Air New Zealand, Jetstar and Virgin Blue who would have to change THEIR interfaces.

Things seem simple when you have a simplistic view. It would costs millions for NZTA to develop the systems to do what POli does. And I am not talking about a simplistic view I am talking about technology, infrastructure, support, reconciliation, bank validation, consultants, security, developers, licences, accounts and personel.

If you think this happens by fairy dust you are deluded.

By: Scott

Scott — Thu, 13 Aug 2009 22:33:09 +0000

Nic, have a look at Poli's website to see what you might expect in terms of quality of their product. HTML 4 transitional in 2009! Awesome…
http://www.poli.co.nz/

By: Scott

Scott — Thu, 13 Aug 2009 22:30:35 +0000

I'd have to disagree with @somebody on just about every count. If you care about accessibility then you wouldn't engage 3rd party components that demand them. The internet is capable of working just fine without Javascript. Javascript should be used to add to the experience, not to define it. The NZTA not being part of the government feels like a cop-out. If they were covered by the legislation, they couldn't use Poli because of the legislation then you'd know that Centricom Pty Ltd would jump to make POLi work without it.

By: Nicolas

Nicolas — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 04:28:07 +0000

@Dave, FWIW, I'm able to use online banking at the National Bank of NZ with javascript turned off.

But what if someone wants to use a credit card rather than online banking to pay the toll. Should they still be limited by the online banking system's restriction to javascript enabled?

By: Dave

Dave — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 04:15:36 +0000

I guess the real question regarding POLi is - how many internet banking sites require Javascript to be turned on to be able to use them?

It's a bit of a moot point to complain about POLi requiring Javascript or not if you couldn't use your internet banking pages with Javascript turned off anyway.

Anyone care to try to use their internet banking with javascript off and report back?

By: Nicolas

Nicolas — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 04:08:18 +0000

@Somebody, thank you for your explanation.

Still seems wrong that access to the entire web-based payment process requires javascript. To say that the site can't be made javascript free because it contracts with a company that requires javascript is a bit like saying that the police must break speed limit all the time because the company that equips police cars require a minimum speed of 120Km/h.

One would think there are ways around this, if some willingness to seek a solution was present in the developers.

I could, of course, be wrong.

By: Somebody

Somebody — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 03:44:07 +0000

Javascript is a requirement because the list of accessible banks is dynamic and accessed from the POLi servers. POLi is not a product of the New Zealand Governement it is produced and run by Centricom Pty Ltd so the interface to POLi was written according to POLi guidelines not the Governments. POLi requires this as part of the contract for using it.